Josh Green
ANNOTATIONS
Learn More: Megan Brenan, “Amid Pandemic, Confidence in Key U.S. Institutions Surges,” Gallup.com, August 12, 2020.
Learn More [2]: Michael Hill, “After Months of Protest and Demands for Change, Where Is Police Reform?,” NJ Spotlight News.
Learn More [3]: David Matthau, “NJ Pairing Cops with Social Workers to Learn De-Escalation Techniques,” New Jersey 101.5.
TRANSCRIPT
Interview conducted by Emma Young
Conducted remotely
August 11th, 2020
Transcription by Rutgers Oral History Archive
0:00
Hi, my name is Emma.
How are you?
Good, how are you? Your name is Josh G. What is your last name, if I could have your basic data?
My last name is Green, like the color.
I am Emma, obviously. Just a basic get to know me. I’m a senior at Rutgers this year, and I do things like this. I interview people sometimes. What about you?
Right now, I’m going to college, but not in Rutgers, at CTU [Colorado Technical University]. I’m going for my degree for science of Business Administration.
I am sorry. I cannot really hear you.
Can you hear me better?
Yes, it is much better. Can you just repeat what you said? Sorry that I missed it.
Going to CTU for science of business administration, so I understand how college life can affect your personal life. I am so excited for you. Have you been doing this a long time?
No, actually you are my second interview. I have done one okay, so this is going to be fine. [laughter] It is cool that we are both college students. I was a little nervous about interviewing someone way older and feeling awkward. That’s great that you are going to college. Also, it kind of sucks because we are in the middle of a pandemic, so college is not quite college right now. We just have to get some basic info that we can put in before they transcribe anything. I am sure Austin already explained it to you. Feel free to answer whatever you want. Also, feel free to omit anything that you want. Do you understand everything about the project and what it is going to be used for?
Yes.
Did he also ask you if you wanted to be able to look at the transcription before they publish it or use it for anything?
No, I guess he forgot to mention that. Yes, I would definitely like to look at the transcripts before they get published.
Okay, so we will just take down your email. You can also use an alias if you want to, which is fun, but you do not have to. That is only if you want to.
I’m fine with Josh.
Your name is Josh Green. We got that. Are you comfortable with giving me your age?
Yes, I’m twenty-nine years old.
What is your gender, if you are comfortable?
Male.
What is your race and ethnicity?
I am African American.
Do you identify with any religion in any way?
My faith is Christianity, spiritual.
What is your place of birth?
Trenton, New Jersey.
Nice, the state capital, that is cool. Where is your last place of residence?
North Brunswick.
The last one is service population. What service are you getting from this organization?
As far as service goes, I’m receiving a little bit of help financially. I’m receiving a little bit of help transportation-wise, due to the fact that the pandemic is being a real restriction on a lot of people as far as resources are concerned. As far as services, I am grateful for the ones that I am getting from NeighborCorps, from outside sources, but as far as services they seem to be pretty well.
That is great. Is it like financial aid and housing?
Yes.
Great. Thank you, again, for doing this.
No problem.
I assume you are at Highland Park Reformed Church.
Yes.
5:45
We are starting this interview now at 11:27 in Highland Park, the Reformed Church, on August 11, 2020. I guess the best way to start would be, how did you get here? What circumstances brought you to this shelter project?
It was fortunate events. I’ve been knowing some of the people behind the scenes that are interacting with everyone that has been affected by the pandemic, so it all started with just a simple phone call. It led through a series of people. Once again, I would like to give credit to Val and Austin of NeighborCorps because they are two great people that I know of that will go all the way out of their way to make sure that you are established in this pandemic. I got to this point here because of talking with Austin. I was told about this interview, so I am very excited.
Thank you. Also, could you please speak up a bit louder? They are mowing, so I cannot hear everything you are saying. I do not want to miss anything you say, of course.
No problem.
It seems like you were lucky enough to know the people in the organization. How did you end up knowing them? Did you hear about the organization through anybody, or did they find you?
I heard of the organization from another individual during my incarceration. As I was getting prepared to be released back into society, I was told of a great reentry program and how they help you, how they counsel with you, and how they use other resources that the government has. I was a given a card, and that card was my own case manager. My case manager was Val, so that’s how I came to know NeighborCorps.
Would you say it was both the Covid pandemic and also having to reenter society that affected your ability to find housing?
I would say it was a combination of a little bit of everything, yes.
8:27
What has your experience been with the pandemic?
No one really prepares you for a pandemic. There’s no guide or anything like that. There’s no one-two-three step book. When the pandemic did hit, it was a shell shock for everyone. For me, it was a culture shock because not only am I now coming back into society after being away for so long, but I’m coming back into society when society itself is in a little bit of a bind and restriction and under oppression. Coming back into society with the coronavirus was very challenging. With the challenges also presented new opportunities, opportunities to grow resourcefully whether it be jobs, whether it be education, whether it be financial, whether it be transportation, or whether it be simply doing projects like this. In a way, the coronavirus created opportunities for people to reconnect differently.
That is really profound. I do not think I have heard a lot of people say that the coronavirus has created opportunities for connection, but I suppose it is true. That is what this project is for. When you were released in the pandemic, what was happening? Did you know of anything happening to your family and friends, what their situations might have been like, too?
I had very little information as supposed to what was going on with my family and friends. When I did finally get to interact with them, I found out that the pandemic had took its toll on both parties and how everyone was trying to readjust to the new society that they were just thrown into. Like I said, no one was prepared for this. No one was warned. No one had anything for preparation. In real time, you had to learn how to adjust your living arrangements, your living style. Your daily routine was no longer daily; it was abnormal. It was a real hard struggle and a challenge for both my friends and my family. Like I said, it also opportunity for creativity. I found that very interesting that people could take one of the most crisis times and use that to their advantage to reach out even more, or stay connected even more, or commit other services for help and other resources. I was really taken aback. As of right now, my friends and family are adjusting very well, still adjusting week by week, day by day, month by month. This pandemic has taught everybody a lot of things.
That is good to hear. I agree with what you were saying about creativity, how people are finding time to be creative now that they do not have a lot of outlets. Have you had a creative outlet in your life, or creative expression? Did you find it when you left? Did you have it when you were in prison?
I believe I always had a creative outlet before prison, even more after I got released from prison because I reinvented myself and rehabilitated. You have a lot of time to reflect on the person that you are– to the type of person that you want to be. Coming back into society, my creative outlet was simply just getting contact with people, just locally first, and then branch out virtually. I didn’t quickly get on the internet because, not the fact that everyone else wasn’t on it, but there is a lot of things that are not happening that the internet is not catching. As far as main events, yes, that’s fine, but as far as your local neighborhood, some of that stuff is not on the internet. That’s not being recorded. That’s not being talked about. How is the pandemic affecting your neighborhood, or how is the pandemic affecting the area that you live in? That doesn’t really get too much of a spotlight. By you living in your community, you can shed that spotlight by interacting with people creatively, as you’re doing right now, gathering a story and a synopsis of how people’s lives are affected.
What is happening in your community that is not being captured right now around the pandemic?
Right now, the community is, I would like to say, rebounding from a struggle because, as far as when the pandemic first happened, everything just totally collapsed. There were no safeguards. There was no safety net. There was no security of what type because there is no way to prepare for something like this. If there is, we didn’t know about it. My community suffered a lot just economically, restriction-wise. There are some things in my community that are still closed down as far as a few stores. These few stores might seem insignificant to somebody on the outside, but living in my community, that store has significant effectiveness to our community as far as what it shares with our community. The local store brings people together as well: shopping, local banks, and everything like that. It just brings the crowd and the population together again, and having that closed down kind of distanced us, so now we have to make the extra effort to either go outside to interact with each other at the park or when we see each other at the laundromat or anything like that. As of right now, my community is trying to get those stores open. We’re talking about school right now. We’re talking about the security for school and everything like that. As far as my neighborhood is financially, we’re rebounding on that as well. Donations are coming in, and we’re receiving help from outside resources. Living in my neighborhood, I get to see it firsthand, my neighborhood being rebuilt from the ground up. It’s simply amazing because when you get born, you get born into society missing the beginning of how everything started. This pandemic reset everything, so now people have to restart their life. You get to see it at its most primal, most basic form. I get to see the foundation of my neighborhood and my community growing from the very beginning.
That is amazing. You said you are currently in North Brunswick.
Yes.
Did you go back home right to your community when you got out?
Yes, I did. North Brunswick is a beautiful community. Not to brag or anything like that, I’m pretty sure your community is just as great. The North Brunswick community is very welcoming. [laughter] It is a very welcoming community, and everyone is welcome. It is so warm, and it is so loving. The community actually embraces you with its local stores and everything like that. People know each other. Once you see somebody for a long time, you see them shopping and everything and you keep running into them. It’s just a beautiful interaction because everyone knows everyone, so it’s like one big family. That’s how I see community, as a big family.
It sounds like you really like community work or community service. Is this something you envision more of for yourself in the future? Does it tie in in any way to what you are studying?
Yes, you’re absolutely right. The reason why I am connected to it so well is because, even though my community is rising, at the same time I am going to Colorado Technical University and I am studying the science of Business Administration. When people hear business, they think of money. The reason why I went into administration specifically is to study structure. Without structural order, you can’t elevate, or profit, or even create an established settlement. Understanding the administrating of a community, the structure of a community is your basic foundation, your pillars. Yes, it does coincide with what I’m studying for my degree. What I’m learning from my degree, I will be able to implement within my own community or someone else’s community, whoever I come across. The structure is never limited.
17:54
That is great. You were saying also that you noticed that your community’s issues are just not put on the internet which makes sense. It is so huge and cannot always have such a precise scope. What would you like the world to know about you and your community, and how the pandemic has affected them?
Well, the first thing I would like to say to the world to know about my community is that my community could be your community at any time. It is our community. It doesn’t belong to anyone. It belongs to all of us, so by coming to North Brunswick, this community will now embrace you and you will be engulfed into it. The love that’s within the community grows even during this pandemic. This pandemic only tested that love. This pandemic only tested the faith of the people’s hearts and the courage that was within their hearts. I commend the people. I commend you, and I commend those who are listened or who will be listening to this that they’re taking the initiative and the step further to be more connected, to be more one. What my community does and specializes in is unity. It doesn’t matter what your background is. It doesn’t matter where you’re coming from. If you’re here in our community, you are one of us. We embrace you fully, so I just see more and more of that every day. There is an improvement of it. It is never stale; it is never old. It’s always a reoccurring feeling, “Wow, I’m in this community. Wow, it’s such a fresh feeling. Wow, I get to wake up to this every morning. Wow, I get to actually live here.” To feel joy, to feel happiness is one thing, but to feel overwhelming joy from where you live at, it’s simply life impacting. When people see that you are joyful and you’re overwhelmed with joy, it’s contagious. It’s a positive energy that can’t simply be restrained. By you spreading that and it becoming contagious, it spreads to the next person and then to the next person. Therefore, you’ll have a community of people that are overwhelmed with joy and with love. You immediately get raptured in. If anybody was in the area or if anybody is looking or interested, North Brunswick is by far one of the best communities. I would say it’s great to live in and grow in.
That is beautiful. It made me miss the Rutgers area in New Brunswick when I heard you talk like that. [laughter] It has been so long since I have been back there. That was great, thank you. There are a lot of other questions though. I do not want to interrupt your flow.
No problem. That’s fine.
You said you are a Christian, but a lot of people have lots of different levels that they ascribe to Christianity. Is there anything faith-based that you are willing to share? Did it influence you in reaching out to this church?
Church-wise, I just want to clear the air on some of the things. It’s not to be argumentative or debating. I’m not pointing anybody out. I’m not trying to put down anyone’s faith. What I’m about to say is to clear the air on the perspective. That’s what I have learned in life; it’s all about how you perceive things. I just wanted to clear up the perspective on Christianity and the Christianity that I have come to serve. As I said before, yes, I am Christian. I am spiritual, so I deal with the effects of what someone has done before me, and that is my savior Jesus Christ. When someone asks, “Are you Christian?” and they see it as religious, I quickly remind them this is nothing law-wise. Being a Christian doesn’t make me better than you. Being Christian doesn’t make me less than you. Being a Christian makes me a better me, so I take that better me and I try to show you what I have received by serving this faith, and living this faith, and embracing this faith. Of course, my prayers and hopes is that everyone comes to know the lord Jesus Christ. My biggest hope is that everyone comes to a perception or a perspective of understanding what Christianity is in its fullest and truest form.
That is usually how my favorite Christians talk, [laughter] just like that. Do you feel that you are comfortable with the religious community that is a part of this organization, that there are people that you also align with in that same way?
I am comfortable because it is still a work of God whether it’s religious or spiritual. I just want to make sure that everyone understands this perspective that religious is what is being seen outwardly. Spiritual doesn’t get too much of a spotlight because that’s between you and God. As far as any type of work, resource, or service in Christianity, or what the church is doing as a body, I say it’s very positive. I believe they’re doing a lot of donations to a lot of shelters lately, a lot of outreach ministries, and a lot of soup kitchen service help. As far as the church is concerned, they’re right on track with what they need to be doing as far as helping people in this pandemic. There is such a light. It doesn’t matter whether you’re a Catholic. It doesn’t really matter what denomination you are; people recognize what good is. Good doesn’t need a title. Good doesn’t need some big symbol. Good just needs to be recognized. Good just needs to be acknowledged. When someone’s doing good, they should be acknowledged. They should be surrounded by other people who have done good. That’s what the church does, and that’s what the church has been doing in this pandemic. When I align myself, I align myself with the Discovering the Jewish Jesus ministry. There have been people in Israel. I align myself with the Jewish Voice ministry. I’m going to be partnering with them also. They will be helping people in Israel. Of course, everyone, like I said, has been affected by the pandemic. Yes, I focus on my community, but I take my skills overseas and internationally and try to make a difference over there as well. It’s a beautiful thing knowing that your voice matters, your actions count, and your purpose is realized. Like I said, good doesn’t need a title. You don’t need to call me a Christian. You don’t need to call me a good man, but my actions reflect the good man that stands before you. My actions or my words reflect the good Christian that stands before you. Just doing good onto others, just trying to go out of your way for that one more person today that you didn’t do for yesterday, or by going that extra step today to do something, even for yourself, it just shows the good that you have in life and that you should be living. That’s the abundant living that we was raised to come to understand and imitate throughout our life.
25:42
That is great, thank you. You were talking a lot about this church organization and other ones that are doing a lot of outreach during the pandemic, obviously doing a lot of good. Were they the only resources that you really see out there? Were you given any sort of other help when you were released? Did the actual prison system give you any resources when you were released?
As far as any resources other than the church, yes, I have seen some others. As far as the prison, the prison has been really restrictive. A lot of the individuals that are incarcerated right now are not receiving the actual, proper care that some civilians are receiving on the outside in today’s society. It’s a very harsh environment inside the incarceration life. It’s very harsh, I should say, political perspective in attributes that are applied to being in that environment and being isolated from the actual sources and cares that the government can provide if you were out here in society. I would like to make people aware that the individuals that are incarcerated are still people at the end of the day. I’m not saying what they’ve done doesn’t matter, I would like to say that what they’ve done is going to either help or show what they need to reflect on as an individual to become better. If we take this opportunity during this pandemic to not show the gratitude towards the men and women that are behind walls and bars that are trying to reinvent themselves, if we don’t show the gratitude of welcoming people back into our society, then we’re no more good than the bars that hold them in place. You see? We’re no more good than those that have been trapped. I have seen other outside resources, and they’re doing well in the community. They’re doing well for schools. I’ve seen some resources for hospitals. I’ve seen some resources for Black-owned businesses. It’s been a lot of movements lately, a lot of peace movements, a lot of unity movements. These movements make resources, and these movements have a big fan base. They have big followers. They have a lot of people that tune in. No doubt, even after this interview, there is going to be followers of this. There’s going to be listeners of this who will spread the word about this. This will be contagious. Making history is very impactful. I always consider my first impression the best impression because it’s what you remember first and last about that person. You will grow to know that person from that perspective. Repeating back to your question, as far as other resources, yes, there are many of them out there, but there needs to be more for those that are incarcerated.
I am sure that your interview is going to be well received in an exhibit or something. I know they plan on using it in coLAB Arts. That will be exciting. You actually brought up something that is a later question, but that is cool. We will go to that because I am interested now that you brought it up. Have you been following, and what are your thoughts on, the recent movements that have happened? Obviously, Black Lives Matter is a big one. There have been some others, too. This does not have to be completely related to the pandemic or not, but you brought it up and I am interested to hear your thoughts.
The movements that are happening today has a two-sided story to it. There’s the pandemic version, and then there’s the actual movement. Yes, you brought up Black Lives Matter. t’s a very controversial topic no matter what the skin color is. Whether you’re Black talking about it, whether you’re white, Spanish, it doesn’t matter. It’s just a very controversial topic to talk about. Once again, I’m no better than anybody else; I’m no less than anybody else. I’m just me, so being me, I’m going to give you a perspective. Maybe from this perspective, people can elaborate or maybe relate to or get a better understanding, but nonetheless acknowledge some truth. As far as Black Lives Matter the movement, I am proud of it. I am fully supportive of it, but what I want to bring to your attention is—because you might not be Black, and I’m not saying specifically you, it’s just saying anybody in general—just because you’re not Black, doesn’t mean your life does not matter. I want that to be very understood because, even though it’s a movement right now, it’s the only thing that’s being advertised on TV, I want you to know that as a Black person, all lives matter. The fact that all lives matter, I’m pretty sure that the awareness needs to be that no matter what ethnicity you are, or what race you are, or what nationality you come by, I believe every nationality and every race was oppressed at one time during history, at one time on this Earth. Oppression doesn’t respect color at all. It doesn’t respect if you’re white. It doesn’t respect if you’re Black or Asian. It doesn’t matter. Oppression is simply that, oppression. It’s a putting down. Black Lives Matter movement is just bringing awareness to this oppression and bringing you to an understanding of this awareness of this oppression. When people scream, “Black Lives Matter,” really what they’re screaming is, “Be aware of the oppression that is not only happening to me and my race, but soon could be happening to your race,” or, “Be aware of the oppression that doesn’t have to happen to your race but is happening to mine, and let us be the example that this is no longer tolerated, that this is no longer acceptable, the conduct that is going on in today’s society.” The response and behavior of the Black Lives Matter movement is to be acceptable: the peace movement, the unity movement, the going forward with younger generations, Black-owned businesses, Black-owned foundations, all lives matter unity outreach, resources and services. This isn’t an “of color” thing when people scream, “Black Lives Matter;” this is an opportunity to recognize the real enemy that is oppression, hate. Hate is not a respecter of color. As far as it being in the pandemic version now, the Black Lives Matter movement, pandemic-wise, seems to be not restricted by this pandemic actually. You cannot silent someone’s voice. You cannot silence someone from speaking what they feel whether they be right or wrong. If it be right, truth prevails. Truth endures. Truth is patient. Truth is a source of what is being revealed at that moment that can give you an enlightenment and allow you to conceive a higher intellect of why things are happening the way they are. I’m taken aback, once again, with what this pandemic has done to people in general and taken aback even further with what this pandemic has done and the opportunities that it has created for organizations and movements like Black Lives Matter. Once again, I just want to put it out there that all lives matter.
34:22
Thank you for that response. I am sorry, I am blanking momentarily. You said something just before about people putting their voices out into the world. The pandemic has not negated people being able to speak out and still keep these movements going forward through things like Twitter, the internet in general. How do you interact with the internet and social media? Is it something that you were attracted to because you were saying that you were taking smaller steps?
Coming back into society, technology was a little difficult for me because I haven’t been using it for a while. Getting back into using technology– it was too funny. Once I got the hang of it, the social media platforms took off with me because I realized now I had a platform where my voice could be heard, where my actions could be seen, where I could reveal and expose, and what perspective I can share with you, and my stories or my creative writing. Yes, I gravitated to Instagram. I gravitated to Facebook. I gravitated to FaceTiming with other people. This interview is just another form although, it’s not an app or anything like that, but it’s another form of interacting and letting my voice be heard as well as letting your voice be heard. Like I said, I’ve been excited the whole time. I couldn’t wait. I’ve also used today's platforms to share the awareness not just about the pandemic, but what to do after the pandemic passes. You want to give people hope that this can pass. This is not your life forever. This is not the final chapter. It’s just a chapter in your life. Like all things, all things pass. They come and they go. Will there be another type of pandemic? We don’t know, but if there is, we can use this pandemic and take the opportunity to learn from it and use it as an example to help the generation after us to better prepare. Using the social media platforms to show people that has been truly effective.
You mentioned that you write.
Yes, I do. I do creative writing. I picked the personal skill up while I was incarcerated. While you are incarcerated, you obviously have a lot of time to reflect. I took that time to write journals, write stories. Me personally, I wrote a nice script for a movie. I’ve written for film. I’ve written for shows. I have scripted some creative writing work for plays. It’s just having the time to put your thoughts on paper, letting it be recorded, letting it be put on display, and reflecting and looking back on it. It’s just a masterwork. It’s just art at its highest form, so creativity is art. No matter whether you’re incarcerated or you’re free, how you choose to be creative and how you choose to reflect yourself to people or to society, it depends on you. That’s what makes you unique and individual, and that’s why no one can copy you.
That is great. So many people are trying to write a book now, but you already had a head start.
[laughter] Yes, I’m very busy.
How did you get into that? Did it start at all in your childhood, or was it recent?
I got into creative writing by actually reading. It was a silly fantasy novel, but it was so open to acceptability of every opinion. I should say, nothing was restricted. Nothing was off-limits. There was nothing that was offensive or anything like that, but what the story enlightened me to is that your creativity is limitless. If it’s your story, then you’re the author. You’re the director, you’re the creator, you’re the architect: tell the story from your perspective. When you’re telling it, be creative so the audience can understand your perspective. When I’m reading the fantasy novel, I’m also in my mind living it out. I’m putting myself in the story. I’m putting myself there permanently, so I’m walking with the characters. I’m interacting with the characters. I’m as if I’m there, but that is my perspective. It inspired me to be creative to write so that I can share this experience with everyone, and so that everyone else can now see themselves in that perspective or in that story. These stories are created for people. It’s not just for me. My creative writing comes from my creative thinking, and my creative thinking just loves to share. It loves to interact with people. It loves to spread that interaction and embracing activity with people. That’s where it really originated from.
Writing is definitely one of those things where you have such control over everything. It is really empowering. Did you have to pursue that on your own? Where there any resources within the prison system that helped with that? I feel like that is such an important thing.
It is such an important thing. What the prisons do for education is they make sure that you have your high school diploma or GED. I already had my high school diploma. I graduated in 2009. When I went to school, I tried to go to college in prison. I ended up doing that as well. I’ll tell you that in a minute, what I achieved. Yes, they did have courses. They did have classroom help. They did have self-help courses of reading, writing, math, language arts, and the basic skills that a person may need for today’s society. What will shock you is that I did not use any of it because writing was such a strong skill of mine, along with reading, along with language arts and math. I was very well balanced even at an early age. My parents made me read college edition books at the age of ten and eleven, so it didn’t seem abnormal to me to interact with people on that type of level, talking about a college subject while you’re still in middle school or writing on a college level when you’re just entering high school. It took back some people, but it has shown a light that somebody is willing to go the step further to improve themselves. Yes, I always had these skills. I’m not saying that the sources that were in the prison were not helpful; I just did not use them. As far as out here, the resources are unlimited. It’s just be like a sponge and try to soak up so much, and add to yourself because you are valuable. The value that you add to yourself comes from your creative thinking. I have taken that upon myself, and now I share that with people.
That is very impressive. That does not sound super fun reading those college-level books at ten, but I am sure you enjoyed it.
No, [laughter] my parents kept me up all night. I mean, it was a school night, but I would read a chapter a night of business administration. I loved business at an early age, so my father made me.
42:36
You were a little businessman. [laughter]
Absolutely, I come from a business-orientated family, so it was just a thing that they did. It was an extra chore. After you cleaned your room, you read a business book. After you were done with your homework, here’s some business work. It was just teaching you how to build character. My parents didn’t want me to run a business at eleven or twelve years old, but they wanted me to understand the concept of running a business and the maturity that it takes and the foundations you need to have as an individual. Yes, I know I didn’t enjoy it when I was young, but being an adult now and looking back on it, I am so grateful that they did it. I am so thankful, and I am so happy that they invested that time into me. I can go back to those roots, and enjoy the fruits of those labors, and really get to blossom, and see myself interact with society using those skills from childbirth and growing up as a child and using them effectively in today’s society.
It seems like they worked just fine. [laughter] You said your parents were interested in business, too. In what ways where they interested in business? What were they doing?
My father started a lawn mower company. He cut grass. He also started a carpet-cleaning company, but together my mother and my father started an enterprise company where they sell retail clothing. They provided a service of sales where people would come and get very essential items. They made their own. I remember late nights helping them make shirts with designs. I remember late nights, I helped stack papers together, so it was their inventory list of all the products that they have. I remember like it was last night, “Hey, Joshua, pass me another box,” or, “Hey, son, pass me this, pass me that. We’re making this tonight. We’re making outfits tonight. We’re making scarves tonight.” It was just so wonderful seeing this trade in action in this format because, when you think of business, you think of, once again, money, currency, finance, or trade. You don’t think of crafting. You don’t think of material building. You don’t think of structure of an inventory list or anything like that. It’s just the simplest things that people don’t take too much care for now these days. They want to buy the shirt, but they don’t take the initiative to know how much was put into the shirt, how much love and dedication was but into this shirt, and how much work it took to craft the shirt that you’re buying or that you’re wearing now. Are you truly appreciating of the person who actually put their time into making the shirt that you’re wearing right now? It showed me that perspective. I fell in love with business because I realized some of the people might not get recognized and their names might not be known, but forever you will enjoy the experience of the shirt that you’re wearing. Forever, you’ll enjoy the experience of the product that you bought from this store. That experience carries into your lifestyle. Then, that person indirectly makes an impact on your life through a product, and that’s where I fell in love with business. I could make an impact on somebody’s life whether directly or indirectly. It’s such a wonderful thing because I have the opportunity to be a helpful individual to you in many sort of ways, various ways. That’s why I fell in love with business, is to help people, to interact with people.
That is great. I think it is true that business can be more than just the buying of things. It can be more creative than that, and it can be more fulfilling than that. You definitely still love business, the idea of having one like that family-run format. Do you have any actual plans for a business later on? You are still in college. I do not know what I am doing after college, [laughter] but maybe you have made some sort of plans.
Since we’re both in college, you know all too well that college life can be very stressful; it can be very straining. While you’re going to school, you’re also trying to do something off to the side. It could be anything. It doesn’t have to be business. It could be just a separate project that you’re trying to do, and you’re trying to make time for it. Between studying, making time for that, and having time for yourself, you have to be the judge of that. I tell you, it’s very interesting. That by itself is very interesting. Yes, getting back to your question, off to the side as I am studying business I am working on my first project which is opening a car business. The name of it will be released pretty soon, actually, on the social media sites that I am on. I’ll be advertising it. I’ll be marketing it. It’s not so much about money or the opportunity to make a profit; the business was built with the sole intentions on how to interact with people in a more positive and effective way. I take great pride in my business because I am going to be interacting with you and making an impact on your life. The product is not so much the primary focus, but the primary focus is you, the person. I never want this society– I never want business to be robotic or so flat and plain to the point that it’s distasteful or that you’re not enjoying yourself. Business should be fun, ecstatic, and dynamic. It should be having various outlets of ways to interact. By starting this car business, I’ll be having that opportunity once again to fall straight in love with it because I’m doing what I love. What I’ve learned in my life is if you do what you love, you tend to be great in it. You tend to be very effective. You tend to be very helpful, and you yourself become a resource for someone else.
That is awesome. It is disappointing that I could not get a car there because we just got one, so I will not be able to frequent your car business for like ten years. [laughter] That is great. Good luck to you with that.
Thank you, thank you so much.
I hope it all works out.
Yes, it will. [laughter]
49:27
We should try to go on now. We have just been talking. [laughter] This is a pretty vague one: how have the conditions of the pandemic impacted your ability to travel or freely navigate the places that you were planning to?
That is a very good question. The pandemic has restricted my traveling which has restricted a lot of other things as far as my business and interacting with others outside of my community, forcing me to be more virtually travelling, if I said that right, or travelling virtually. The pandemic has put a restriction physically. Trying to go to another state right now is very scary for some individuals. Some individuals are very paranoid, talks about a second is going to hit, talks about the corona never left. That person’s state could still be a hot zone. It’s just the things that you have to remind yourself that you’re getting into when you visit another person’s state or county or town. Me personally, trying to travel was very difficult, so I’m now trying to establish a safer route through government transportation because I realized that government can go anywhere no matter what happens. During any type of crisis, the government always has better access to travelling than you do, so try to find a way for the government to be your main transportation or a service of transportation. That is my source of transportation as of right now, through the government and the services that they provide.
Your travel, is it personal? Is it trying to find business opportunities or avenues?
Another good question, well, it’s a little bit of both actually. Like I said, I haven’t been out for a very long time. I’m just under a hundred days of being released from incarceration, so I haven’t even lived a hundred days in society yet. Travelling, to me, is just life changing. It is exhilarating. I take travelling very serious, in a fun way. [laughter] I’ll be trying to travel for personal reasons just for sightseeing, vacation, relaxation, a little bit of R and R, and interacting with people. Yes, business-wise as well because it’s taking your brand, taking your name, taking who you are, what you reflect to your community, and bringing it to another community, bringing it to another individual or another establishment, a settlement of any type. I am excited for travelling for more than just one reason, personal and business.
That is kind of like being an ambassador for yourself.
Yes, for yourself, a consultant, right. [laughter]
Exactly, then you said something that is not surprising but kind of shocking in a way. You said that you have only been out for a hundred days. That seems very recent. I mean a hundred days is a few months, but that seems very recent. That seems like it would be like a culture shock. What is the actual timeline of you getting out? Was it in March or April?
I was released May 18th of 2020.
53:18
It was in time for the summer at least [laughter] although, there was not much happening. At least it was warm when you got out. This is an interesting one. If you are comfortable sharing, in what ways do you feel like your own identity in all aspects like gender, race, sex, economic has impacted the way you are experiencing this pandemic?
Interesting question, you got a couple of them.
Yes, it is a lot.
Yes, [laughter] if I could be blunt with it, you’re basically asking, if I’m grasping that right, how is the pandemic affecting me as far as these categories. As far as race-wise, this pandemic has affected me little to no effect. I don’t experience any type of barrier. If anything, people are more welcoming because of the pandemic. I think people are starting to understand that it doesn’t matter where you’re from, or what background you have, or what your color is, you’re still a human being. You’re still a life. You still have a heartbeat. You still have a soul. To interact with you, even if it’s just saying hi or good morning, can make that person’s day and can let that person know that they have been acknowledged by somebody else, and that they’re just not traveling through this thing called life by themselves. I’ve experienced multiple occasions where I’ve been interacting with my local neighbors, my community, outside my community. As far as my gender, people respect my gender. People understand my gender. As a male in today’s society, we are supposed be a figure of strength and a supportive nature. I’m not saying that no one else can’t, no matter what your gender is. I’m not saying no other gender can’t. I’m just saying, as a man speaking from a man’s perspective, we are under a magnifying lens as far as what we bring to society in a strength and supportive type of way, caring type of way, family leadership type of way, and teamwork type of way. Whether your counterpart is male or female, how well do you guys work together? How well do you guys build together? How well do you guys elevate each other, complement each other, give each other positive vibes? This pandemic really makes you focus on the love languages of people, and learning that love language or learning that person’s love language allows you to be more effective in their life in a positive way. This pandemic allows me as a male to come across anybody and let them know, let them see the best side of me. Interacting with people during this pandemic has just been a blissful, exciting experience.
That is great.
Thank you.
You were saying before that, with the pandemic, it creates so many opportunities. I think this is a feeling that a lot of people have right now, that the pandemic is an opportunity to seize the moment. Do you have things that you wish to see continue after the pandemic, like things that you want to have stay in power?
As far as thing that I want to stay in power, things that I want to change, I try not to voice my opinion too much on it because it could offend somebody. That’s not my perspective; that’s not my goal to offend anybody.
Of course, this is your interview. Feel free to give me feedback.
Just for conversation’s sake, what I would like to remain is that local stores remain open, essential medical places remain open because, no matter what, pandemic or not, medication is very important to anybody who is taking it. They should always have full access, fast access to it, within your community, on your phone, where you stay at. The one thing I want to change is just how law enforcement and people get along. I want that to get better. I want that to improve. I want your thought to be, when you get pulled over, the thought that goes through your mind is, “Is this going to be my last day?” or, “Is this going to be an interaction where it might cost me fatally? Is there any problem that I fear for my life?” Anything like that, so I want that relationship between people because I don’t necessarily need to give you a title to treat you better. It doesn’t matter your title is, you’re still a human being. You’re still life. You’re a reflection of what life is, and no one can copy you. You can’t be copied. This is a once in a lifetime. You are a unique person. There’s only one of you ever in life, so taking that opportunity to interact with you in a positive way is a once in a lifetime. It’s history. It’s impactful. No matter how impactful it might seem to you or how less impactful it might seem to someone else, it’s very impactful, nonetheless. So, I would like that to change. I would like that to get better. The one thing I would like to congratulate and just say I’m grateful for is the service the government is giving: the free loans, stimulus checks, housing, free financial aid. The list goes on. I swear, the list goes on, but just improve in the areas that you’re already strong at. My main focus is just keeping going in the right direction and not stopping. I think taking strides to success is one step at a time. If you continue to step, you continue to step closer to success.
1:00:20
You also told me earlier about how you got into creative writing, what resources there were in prison, and how you already have a diploma. You mentioned briefly college, then you said, “I will tell you more about that later.” Since now is later, I would love to hear about college. Do you have anything to say about it?
College, yes, the creative writing inspired me to go back to college as well. Now that I am taking the science of business administration, one of the subcategories is academic writing, so right up my alley because I love writing. [laughter] I took that time to really buckle down and learn a different aspect of writing, one that I never would’ve saw or perceived in any way during my life if I wasn’t introduced to it through CTU, which is Colorado Technical University. Taking that academic writing and blending that with my creative writing, my writing has skyrocketed to new limits because writing overall I loved anyway. I love writing journals, even to my professor, even to my success coach at the schools. Complements are so exciting because they’re so taken aback by the accomplishment of how well the writing is, how creative it is, and how much thought was put into the writing. Going to school was another step closer to success. I’ll be taking that and applying that to society in every aspect that I can.
That is awesome. Based on how eloquent you are, I am sure your writing is great. This is a question I thought of: what is your living situation now? I hope everything is pretty stable.
As far as my living arrangements now, I’m going to give you two sides: what my living arrangement was going to be without the pandemic, and what my living arrangements are now in the pandemic. My living arrangement was supposed to be a fully laid out house. I guess three bedrooms and a nice yard and everything like that. Due to the pandemic, a lot of people lost their housing. A lot of people lost where they stayed. A lot of people got put out of their house. A lot of people would end up homeless. My family took the initiative to save up everything that they had left that the pandemic did not destroy or did not salvage. They took that and bought a condominium apartment, so now my living arrangement is not the three-bedroom, but it’s still just as spacious. It’s still just as comfy. What I believe is home should be a place of comfort. Home should be a place of peace, so home could be wherever you are. Your office could be your home because you’re comfortable, you’re at peace there. You’re in your own environment, your own sanctuary. It’s a way to shut yourself off from the outside world and just enjoy your space, and I have that. My living arrangement is positive. My living arrangement is healthy. Once again, not as big as I would like it to be but comfortable, nonetheless, and very peaceful even during this pandemic.
You cannot ask for much more than that. I feel like we really just sped through all of these questions so seamlessly. Thank you. [laughter] I guess we would end the interview here, but if you would like, you can give some parting words. What would you like to see happen in the world? What do you hope this interview might do?
My parting word to you and to the audience is– when I was little, my teacher would always tell me, “Where do you see yourself three to five years, or seven years from now?” That question got repeatedly asked of me as I went through middle school to high school. Looking back on it now, I understand what my teachers were doing. They were trying to prepare me to think ahead of time and think for the future. My parting words to you guys would be that this pandemic is not what defines you. This pandemic refines you actually. It makes you a better person. It sharpens you as an individual. It tests your intellect, your courage. It tests your heart, really, and wherever your faith may life at. During this pandemic, I only say to look beyond the pandemic. Look to a future, look to a society where your future is blossoming three years from now, finish school, the dream job that you always wanted, the house you always wanted. Imagine yourself in your dream car or with your dream job and really live it out. What I mean by live it out, I mean speak it out. During my incarceration, one of my goals every morning was to tell myself, “I’m going to be successful.” I woke up every morning reminding myself, not that I needed reminded, but that you’re speaking a positive word into your life. You’re speaking positivity into your life. You’re speaking your future into existence. It’s not crazy to speak out loud how you feel. People think out loud all day. Why not take that time to speak to and invest into yourself? Speak into your own future, “Hey, I’m going to be successful in two years because I’m going to do this and this and that,” or, “Hey, I’m going to finally have my dream job that I’ve been chasing for because I’ve studied so hard and I’ve dedicated time to do this and this and that.” Success is all about the mind and how well you believe in it. If you believe in yourself, you believe in success. My parting words to you is take success and make it your identity. Make success what you dream of. Make success what you love, and you will end up living that. You will end up walking right into your success because you were thinking about it, living it, speaking it your entire life. It’ll come to a shock, but it won’t be a shock to you at all because you were talking about it the whole time. I talk about being a great writer. I talk about being a great businessman because, not only do I believe that, but I speak that. When people hear me speak, or when people see me interact with them, they see that I’m living my dream. They see me living my success. They see that new identity that I have– and it didn’t take seven years or three years. It might take seven or three years; it’s the fact that you reach it. That’s the story that you want to share with anybody you come across. Imagine and picture yourself three years from now. Picture yourself a year from now. Picture yourself after this pandemic, your restart. Picture your development. Picture how you’re going to put things together, how you’re going to budget. Don’t worry yourself with problems and obstacles, no. Imagine yourself overcoming these obstacles. Imagine yourself not being concerned but being aware of any problems in your life and how you’re going to solve them, and taking the necessary procedures and doing the steps to problem solving and process of elimination. I say to you, as I say to myself, I am going to be successful. I’m going to continue to be successful, and I’m going to continue to live my successful life. Hopefully, I get to interact with you or anybody else who gets to be the audience to this interview. It’ll be such an exciting and thrilling thing to have my life be heard by you and the actually interact with you. It’s just going to be a great joy. I picture you successful in a year, three years, seven years; nonetheless, I picture you successful.
Thank you.
You’re welcome.
That is a great way to end it. Those are great words to end on.